Eastern Conference contender? A move like this should instantly catapult them into contention…IF O’Neal stays healthy and recaptures his All-Star form from a couple seasons!
I don’t have all the info yet, but the principles are:
To Indiana:
TJ Ford
Rasho Nesterovic
# 17 Pick
Another player to be named later (either Joey Graham or Maceo Baston)
To Toronto:
Jermaine O’Neal
More details to follow as I get them (in the middle of a poker game).
UPDATED…..
What to say…what to say…
Normally, landing someone of O’Neal’s calibre would be great news. The fact of the matter, for me anyways, is that seemingly, the Raptors gave up a lot of assets (4 for 1) to land O’Neal. We started the summer with 5 players with expiring contracts (Rasho, Parker, Garbajosa, Graham and Baston) for a total of about $20.5mil in expiring contracts, TJ Ford - a starting point guard in the NBA and the 17th pick.
The priorities for the summer were, in no particular order:
- Get some help in the paint for Bosh on the offensive and defensive end.
- Get a scoring/slashing 3 who can create his own shots…and start of course.
- Fix the Forderon situation.
- Get another 2 to either replace Parker in the starting lineup, or be a solid backup.
- Fix Bargnani.
So we trade 4 of our 7 chips to get one player, we let another walk (pay him $2mil, and pocket another $2mil) that does more harm then good IMHO, can’t trade Parker now, because we need him at 2, and the lineup is a bit depleted….oh yea, no cap flexibility next summer.
We do have the mid-level, but who can we conceivably get to fill the 3 with under $6mil? Signing Delfino becomes a sticking point. We can’t let him leave now, and may have to overpay.
What it does do is potentially give Calderon a sign that he is the man in Toronto, and hope to G*d Riley doesn’t sign him to an offer sheet that would seriously sodomize the Raptors cap situation even more.
So after all that:
- We got Bosh his help in the paint on both ends.
- We don’t get a quality 3, unless we can talk Pietrus into the mid-level.
- Forderon is no more.
- Not going to get a 2 to help out Parker.
- Bargnani…fuck…
All-in-all, still probably hovering around .500 unless another quality player who can score and defend on the wings is brought in. I should have more to add tomorrow when I get a couple hours sleep.
Oh, if you were wondering about how poker went…
Who da man?
I da man!
WHO DA MAN?
I DA MAN!!
PS - Phdsteve called this trade, say what you want about whether or not it is a good one, we have a man on staff who suggested a better trade then what BC got. He was able to make it work without sacrificing our pick this season, and he got us a young forward in Williams.
Technorati Tags: Andrea Bargnani, Anthony Parker, Carlos Delfino, Indiana Pacers, Jermaine O’Neal, Joey Graham, Jorge Garbajosa, Jose Calderon, Maceo Baston, Mickael Pietrus, Rasho Nesterovic, Shawne Williams, TJ Ford
+0
June 25th, 2008 at 10:21 pm
lets not forget the fact that this story was FIRST reported on this very website 1 month ago.
June 25th, 2008 at 10:44 pm
Including the pick is insane, case closed. If there are four players involved in a trade for Jermaine O’Neal on his own, then this team is THROUGH. Colangelo should be marched out of town.
If you think this is a good trade, while it opens up more holes than we already had, I’d love to hear your take.
AltRapss last blog post..Best Raptor Ever – 21st Bracket
June 25th, 2008 at 11:14 pm
Why on God’s green earth must we swap a gimp for a gimp?
I’ll admit that I won’t miss covering my eyes everytime TJ drives the basket,but O’Neil will only show flashes of his pre injury self,he’ll never be the same,the pick turns this into a very bad deal
June 26th, 2008 at 12:03 am
Altraps and Swirsky
I agree that the trade with the #17 pick is not the best, but I feel that the Raps got the best player they could for Ford. The four players for JO is based on salaries. i don t agree that it opens up more holes finishing this team. JO takes Rashos position, Calderon takes Fords. In fact, it just comes short of filling the 2/3 problem. It makes it more difficlut without the #17 to fill the 2/3. What this deal does, being made before free agency opens (JUL 1) tells the rest of the league that the pg problem is gone and trying to force BC’s hand after July 1 by signing Calderon to an offer sheet is pointless. This deal brilliantly allows BC to trade from a position of strength and stopped other gms from fleecing the raps later, while signing Calderon to an extension just above mid level instead of a ridiculous 10 mil
One great point about this is that ONeal makes alot of money and if he turns out to be a bust (which he wont) we have 23 Mil in cap space that opens up in 2 years. Re-signing him will be much cheaper freeing the raps up to make a run at Lebron and co (though he’ll never come here, ever.)
And lastly, basketball reasons. JO, before last seasons injuries, has averaged 20 and 10, 2 assists and 2 blocks a game. He fills a MAJOR hole at center, brings toughness, rebounding, and defense immediately while being a legitimate second scorer for the Raps. This leads to more honest defense from their opponents with him and Bosh in the middle, creating more space for shooters.
June 26th, 2008 at 12:18 am
If JO was healthy,younger,and signed for at least 3 years,I’d feel differently,but regardless of the crapshoot a 17th pick can be,I’d rather we get a healthy body not in decline.
June 26th, 2008 at 12:21 am
I think including 17th pick was maybe too much on raptors part.. but indiana wouldnt have dealt o’neal if that was not in it. Sources say O’neal is healthy, also BC said he will try to get late first round pick. this draft is deep we could get a good player late first round…
also now we need to add a backup PG. possiblities are roko ukic from over seas.. as long as we get someone who can bring the ball up . that will be good.
its funny i read some comments by pacer fans and they said indiana is dumb for getting rid of their leader.. well he wasnt playing anyways and they did relatively well.. well i hope adding JO will help us win a series in the playoffs
I dont think we have anymore cap space to sign anyone in the free agency market do we? yeah i didnt think so.. ..
well instead of athletic wing i guess we have to settle for JO for at least 2 yrs.
June 26th, 2008 at 12:32 am
There will be nights that the JO/CB combo will have Raptors fans salivating,but I just don’t see it happening often enough over the long haul of a season and playoffs
June 26th, 2008 at 12:34 am
JO is only 29 and seems like he is old because he has been in the league since he was 18. That being said, name a player that would step in at center and produce # anywhere near Oneal from the #17 pick. Even if Oneal can only manage #’s for the Raps like he did last year in Indy (13 ppg and 6rpg) that is way better than any big man that they could have drafted.
Two years of JO at 20+ million is enough, and re-signing him in 2 years, if the raps can, will be much cheaper and create cap space in two years. This is a fantastic deal for the Raps.
That being said, don’t be so quick to judge BC about the pick. With so many teams still talking trade, I would be shocked if this is the only trade from BC before/during the draft.
June 26th, 2008 at 12:35 am
One last thought,do we know it JO will be happy as a Raptor?
June 26th, 2008 at 12:44 am
Gino, with all due respect, I disagree on almost every point you made, EXCEPT the fact that, yes, he gives us cap room 2 years from now. Great, well, that’s how we looked at Rasho and look where this is (potentially) getting us. And the only reason this thing HAS to wait until July 1 is for Fords BYC to come off, so your lauding of BC for doing it before July 1 is meaningless. Also, if someone wants to sign Jose to an offer sheet to drive his price up and take more of our cap room, this trade does nothing to stop it. If nothing else, other teams know we don’t have a fallback and have no choice but to match. And, sure, they keep the defence honest, but who are these “shooters” you refer to?
I’ve always seen JO as a PF and that was even before his injuries. Regardless, who you got at centre now? As Krazie says, who you got at PG now?
We were a .500 ballclub this year. You are taking away our starting PG, our (oft times) starting centre, any young talent for the future (17th pick and no pick last year), plus some other body to fill the $$$ requirements…in return you get a 2 year rental option. Are you kidding me??? Sure, the photo ops will be great, as he and Bosh will look great side by side in their lovely red garb, and for 30 games I’m sure the tandem will work brilliantly.
Unlike Krazie, most of the Indy stuff I’ve read (and as Grange pointed out) have been all for the trade since they want the oft-injured sucky boy out. Sure sign for what you want coming in.
Colangelo better have something else up his sleeve because all we’ll have left is the mid-level plus ~2mil from Garbo. Lovely. Wonder if Popeye Jones is feeling comeback.
June 26th, 2008 at 12:48 am
Gino, who said we needed to draft a big? IMO drafting a capable player (any position) and keeping Rasho one more year would provide better results than mortgaging your future by losing the pick and next years cap space. If everybody is loading for bear in 2010, you have to think some shiny pieces might come up next summer.
Swirsky, is he ever happy?
AltRapss last blog post..Best Raptor Ever – 21st Bracket
June 26th, 2008 at 1:02 am
It’s all good,Martin comes out of retirement and we’re covered at pg,lol
If BC didn’t have the rep of being a God people would(and might still) be all over this theft.I don’t see what cards BC still has to play,after tossing in the 4th player our roster is pretty thin
June 26th, 2008 at 1:27 am
i wouldn’t call this a theft. indiana got two starters the 17th pick, probably joey graham or maceo baston, and some cap relief at the end of the year. the raptors are hoping o’neal stays healthy and returns to form.
this trade makes the release of garbo look even worse. alt says it, all we have left is the mid level and the 2mil savings from the release. not nearly enough to fill the starting 3 spot.
this trade is similar to last years celtics when they got ray allen first. the only difference is that the raptors don’t have an al jefferson to land a garnett (in our case a 3) unless bargnani has some hidden value no one is aware of…
June 26th, 2008 at 1:28 am
i think this is a great trade i dont c how it makes more problems for the raps and BC knows what he is doing.
June 26th, 2008 at 1:35 am
JO is still young and he is good defender, rebounder and scorer, i can c him as a double double guy IF he can stay healthy
June 26th, 2008 at 5:16 am
when i think about it were (toronto) are losing, Rasho has inproved big time during the season scoring but 20 a game during the last month of the season for the raps and giving away the #17 draft is gonna hurt us abit could have got us some talant. Liked TJ but dont really mind him goin. hate that a fourth person has to go too.
June 26th, 2008 at 5:41 am
The question is did we trade for the JO of four years ago or for the JO of the last four years. If it’s the the latter, we gave up too much. I would’ve liked to draft at #17 and pick a young gun.
Coming into the offseason I though we could’ve addressed our rebounding and scoring needs through the TJ Ford trade and the draft but we just packaged both our assets for a player that was good four years ago.
It’s a gamble and I think the Raptors gave up a lot and assumed the greater risk.
Arsenalists last blog post..Raptors assume greater risk as TJ Ford and 17th pick traded for Jermaine O’Neal
June 26th, 2008 at 6:16 am
Do not like the trade and another 2 years of maybe 500 ball. This team is again headed into lottery land. And I would not blame Bosh for walking in 2 years. If that happens think of how few players this team will have. Guess you could always hold a tryout camp and pick the best 11.
The only way this works if JO/Bosh get hurt and the team wins 12/14 games over the next 2 years. That way they would have high lottery picks (oh wait they probably will trade them away) and use the huge amount of cap space to land some sound talent. Probably will not be BC by that point and the Euro experiment would be over.
June 26th, 2008 at 8:45 am
well done phsteve, you were right about the trade and I give you props. I was one of the people who was against this trade basically because of the draft pick, but now that it’s 99% sure of happening I’m liking the thought of JO in TO.
it is one of those high risk/high reward trade. HollywoodGIno had it right, we got the best player for FOrd. we got rid of our whining pg, expiring contract of our starting C (that didnt play in the playoffs) and nobody player and the #17 pick (which sucks, but wouldnt have happened without it). “IF” JO can return to form and put up 20 and 10 and provide some big D then the raps are laughing in this trade, but if he gets injured (fingers crossed) then this trade will suck for the raps.
both Ford and JO must pass physicals (obviously) so we will know if “the real oneil” is in good shape. I am officially on the JO bandwagon and feel he will give TO one of the top frontcourts in the NBA.
BC isnt letting us bloggers see his cards…this wont be the last move.
oh yeah, there is a lot of talk about the garbo release and how his contract couldve been used. BC is no idiot and I dont think Garbo would have passed a physical which would have made him a useless trade piece
June 26th, 2008 at 8:57 am
It’s annoying to lose the draft pick but the pick wasn’t valuable enough to stop the deal over it.
Daves last blog post..Pacers-Raptors Trade Near Completed
June 26th, 2008 at 9:32 am
what do the raps do now? they’ll need to fill out some roster spots and address the scoring/defensive 3 via trade or free agency.
the raps are left with Bosh, Calderon (RFA), Parker, Bargs, JO, Grahme or Baston, Hump, Moon, Kapono, and Delfino. if they dont re-sign Delfino and lose either Joey G or Baston in the JO trade the raps will have 9 roster players, which means they’ll need to sign 3 players. Roko Ukic and Giorgos Printezis could join the squad, Roko more than Giorgos.
here are a list of available 2/3’s in order I would take them: Pietrus, Bonzi Wells, Ricky Davis, Matt Barnes, Nachbar, Michael Finley, Eddie House, Devin Brown, Kareem Rush, Gordan Giricek
I wish we could somehow land Antawn Jamison…that would be awesome!
I like either BOnzi or Pietrus. Wells can score in a number of ways and plays decent D; Pietrus has more upside, but has been under used in GS.
June 26th, 2008 at 9:38 am
raptors will get the 41st pick and send Baston to the Pacers
June 26th, 2008 at 10:56 am
Altraps
No disrespect taken, we all have our own opinions. I also disagree with everything you have said, so we are even.
As I said earlier, and was reiterated by Dave, the #17 was not of enough value to stop the trade for BC, or would have performed better than JO. Nobody the raps would have drafted at 17 would have had any impact remotely close to JO. NO one
The shooters I was mentioning were:
1) Jason Kapono (Best 3 point shooter in the league, period)
2)Anthony Parker
3)Calderon
All shoot a high % and having a low post presence makes it a little easier to get them clean looks. This causes low post mismatches for other teams. And yes, JO has been a center, not a pf for a few years now. that is where he will play. He is a defensive presence, a shut down defender at C and he can score and rebound.
As far as Calderon goes, the raps have him locked up now. I know that other teams can still sign him to an offer sheet, like Riley. Now that Ford is gone, all other teams know FOR SURE that the raps cannot be bullied away from Calderon or forced to make a bad trade because they still had Ford on their roster. I know they cannot officially announce the trade until July 1, but Im sure all the gms in the league are aware and informed of this trade. Had we still had Ford, and then another gm signs Calderon to an offer sheet, the raps would have had 7 days to match or deal him (or deal ford) forcing the raps to make a poor trade trying to dump a pg. This has avoided that situation.
To look at it another way, we gave up:
1)TJ Ford: A player who plays great, has injury problems, and was not welcome back in Toronto after last seasons poisoning of the clubhouse.
2)#17 - this late in the draft (any draft) is a crapshoot, you never know what you can get or if they pan out. With Raps biggest need being defense and interior toughness, no one would have been better than JO. Even if they drafted a 2 or 3, they still later would have had to fill the C position. I think this was more important than the 2/3 problem. Lots of available guys at 2/3 that can be signed for Mid level this offseason.
3)Rasho- I dont like to see him go but he is not the stopper in the middle we need and with Garnett, Howard, Wallace to name a few of the centers we must get past to win the east, Rasho wasn’t the answer and would have been traded soon anyway.
4)A filler (Joey Graham or Maceo Baston) who really dont play well or very much and are of no use to this team other than filling a place on the bench.
All in all I realize that JO is a risk due to his problems recently, but if he passes his physical and can perform like he did at his worst offensively last season, then he is an improvement. If he performs like he did the previous 6 seasons (in which he was an all star) then we stole an amazing player out of Indy.
June 26th, 2008 at 11:13 am
WOW- lots of people have lots to say!
Ive already said my piece defending this trade many times over the last month so I wont waste any more blog space (check out the archive in May and June to see my thoughts). I will only say this:
JO instantly makes this team a 50 win team, and the #3 seed in the East even if there are no more moves. JO fills all 3 of the main holes in the Raps roster:
1) INTERIOR D (one of the 5 best defensive players in the league) his D with Bosh at the 4 will make up for the deficiency of guys like Kapono, AP, or Il Mago who keep getting taken off the dribble. He has averaged over 2 blocks per game for the last 8 seasons (even when he wasnt healthy).
2) REBOUNDING
even last year he averaged 7 rebounds a game, and in the 7 previous years his rebound averages were 9.6,9.3, 8.8,9.8,10.0,10.3,10.5 and 9.8
in comparison: Rasho and Bargnani in the last 2 years in Toronto- put together averaged less than 10 rebounds a game (Rasho 4.8, 4.5, Bargnani 3.9,3.7).
3) A REAL SECONDARY SCORER
in the last 7 years he averaged over 19 points 6 times, averaged 2 assists per game 6 times, and got to the line an average of 5 times a game. AND he has never had the opportunity to play next to a player of Bosh’s caliber who not only averages 20-10 but also demands a double-team. this means a lot more easy baskets and open looks for JO.
the Raps were able to get ALL 3 of these without giving up anything from their core. I love TJ- but he was an extra on this team. I liked Rasho but Rasho is the VIVA to JO’s TTC. A second class service with a first class price tag. And at 17 they could have got a good player, but they also could have got another Joey Graham (who they picked at 16). the draft is just that- and by the time you get out of the lottery its all hit and miss. If the Raps still want a guy like a CDR or NBA ready player- picks have already been available (see Denver and New Orleans) and will continue to be ready throughout the day. BUT to suggest that this team got ripped off- come on Raps fans- its time to be happy- we finally made a good trade.
I gotta say a starting 5 of
JO
CB4
Kapono
AP
Calderon
looks pretty good. Calderon as the #3 scoring option is pretty darn good- and with a strong defensive front line like JO and CB4 you can afford to start Kapono and then make other teams REALLY pay for doubling Bosh- because the truth is now you cant- because you will 3 starters who can shoot the 3 (two fo whom shoot it at close to 50% in Calderon and Kapono) and you now have a legitimate low post threat. Damn thats hot!
lastly,its a good trade all around, even John Hollinger, the grumpiest analyst on the net likes the deal-
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=Onealtrade-080625
oh ya, and one more thing- enough of the JO missed so many games garbage. OK, last season JO missed a lot of games (but the team shut him down after the all star break- there are rumblings he could have played) AND havign had that much time off, should he be well rested? He will definately be motivated to proove a lot of people wring.
AND FYI:
Tim Duncan has played less than 70 games 3 times in his career, including back to back seasons of 03-04 and 04-05 but no one is writing him off.
Ron Artest (in addition to being a crack pot) has only played over 75 games ONCE in his career, and has played less than 60 games 4 times including last year BUT everyone still talks about how good their team could be if they added him.
Andrew Bynum missed more than half the season last year (he only played 35 games) but everyone is saying that next year when he comes back the Lakers will be the favorites in the west- and Bynum hasnt done ANYTHING in his career. JO is a 6 time allstar, an MVP finalist, and multiple time defensive player of the year nominee.
Im done defending this trade. Raps fans will see for themselves. The haters lineup can start right here, but dont worry, I’ll save a seat on the wagon for you for next March when we’re rolling into the playoffs with Detroit and Boston on our minds.
now if only I could get BC to read my blog about drafting CDR before 8 pm tonight?!
June 26th, 2008 at 11:33 am
I suggest everyone do as I just did and listen to phsteve and read John Hollinger’s article.
June 26th, 2008 at 11:54 am
I think we might be overestimating the 17th pick. Plus, the raptors don’t exactly have a great history of making genius draft picks, especially in the late first round. I’m happy with this deal, but I will be ecstatic if they can make a further trade to get Bargnani out of town and bring in a legit 3. Because we can’t possibly think of starting Moon or Kapono at the 3.
Maybe they will start Kapono at the three this year? Who knows? With those two beasts down low he will be getting a lot more open looks.
June 26th, 2008 at 11:56 am
PhD Steve, brilliantly put. I totally agree with everything you said. I have no problem with looking at the Raps with a critical eye, but you have to be miserable to get down about this trade. Before this trade, the best C we have ever had was Antonio Davis (also in a draft day trade from Indy), and O’Neal is much better than him. JO opens up a lot of opportunities for everyone else on the team. We don’t need a slasher that can rebound anymore, we have the best 3pt shooter in the league that can safely play there now (and have Moon where he should be, backing him up)! This trade makes Bosh better, JO better, Il Mago becomes the instant offence of the bench (a role he is much better suited to), gives Jose another option after the high pick and roll with Bosh. People who are moaning about this trade don’t seem to be objective about this, and they certainly don’t sound like Raps Fans. It is silly for a blogger to say that there were better trades available, or that we didn’t need to give up our draft pick. Just because we could think of a trade we like better doesn’t mean that the other GM’s in the league would make those trades. Only BC knows what was available and I am willing to trust that he took the best option. Yes we are going to have to do our homework now to fill out our roster, particularly with the back up PG, but all our depth last year didn’t do anything for us because our starting 5 always left us in a deep hole. We have a very strong starting 5 now. Our 1st big off the bench has loads of potential and Hump can bring a lot of energy. Moon, Graham and Delfino are decent options off the bench at the wings too - though I admit we could still use an upgrade here the need is no longer so strong now that we have a 2nd scoring option and our interior D is sured up. Really, the only glaring hole is at the back up PG. I doubt Roko-Ukic is ready but we have the entire MLE to throw at players like Duhon. BC is pretty good at finding those mid-tier, under the radar type talents that are under the radar and will fill out the roster nicely. The thing is that this year, those talents will be at the end of the bench instead of starting! Cheer up Raps fans - only time will tell, but I think we just got a whole lot better!
June 26th, 2008 at 12:37 pm
Thanks Phd Steve,
You said what I have been trying to say, just in a more effective manner. VIVA to TTC, brilliant!
June 26th, 2008 at 12:58 pm
Robert Archibald..are you “the Robert Archibald”?
http://www.nba.com/raptors/news/PR_Raptors_Acquire_Archibald_040102.html
either way, you and I appear to see eye to eye on a whole lot of things. I especially like the idea of throwing the mid-level at Duhon. As I mentioned in my GM for a Day post- I think he would be a perfect 2nd option for the PG to back up Calderon, and you could play him a little bit at the 2 as well.
June 26th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
Lol, you know what they say about great minds. To answer your question, No I am not one of the original ‘Banger Brothers’ (another Swirsk creation). I am from Toronto but am currently living in Scotland, so I figured that was an appropriate handle. For those wondering though, I recently saw on the UK feed that old Archie is still playing in Europe and that he will be trying out for the UK team along with Luol Deng and possibly Ben Gordon.
June 26th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
i would like to the raptors throw the mid-level at a mickael pietrus type player. i really think he would be a great fit, and have lots of room to slash with kapono/delfino/parker/calderon on the perimeter and bosh/o’neal in the blocks. duhan would be a nice addition, but i want to see what ukic does before we commit $14-$16mill at the point again.
June 26th, 2008 at 3:00 pm
fair enough raps fan. I agree that a slashing 2/3 would be nice and is probably more of a priority than a back up guard. Im just not sold on Pietrus. I mean we could have signed him last year as could every other team but he didnt get 1, not 1 offer? Nellie pretty much lets anyone run and gun in his system, so how cuold a super athletic swingman who can also defend and who attacks the basket not find minutes on that team? He complained last year that he was unhappy and wanted to be moved, and even with a 10 million dollar trade excemption and a player of pietrus’ caliber, Mullin couldnt trade him for a player that could have helped GS win 1 more game and make the playoffs? It just doesnt all add up and I guess thats my concern with Pietrus.
what a bout Magette? Now, I have said on more than 1 occasion that he is NOT coming here…BUT…what if Colangelo was willing to put Bargnani and APs expiring or local boy Kapono into a sign and trade? I dont think its going to happen but man, wouldnt that be awesome- our own big three-. Would LA do it…probably not, unless ofcourse Magette was going to walk for nothing, and then came up empty handed tonight at the draft in trying to move up and get a good young player to build around. This is not a real rumour, just more like a little bit of daydreaming.
I still think CDR is the cheapest way to address this issue. The pick (somewhere in the mod to late 20s, like Memphis at 27) would only cost $, and then CDRs salary at a pick that low is only approx 1 mill guarneteed for the next couple of years.
June 26th, 2008 at 3:11 pm
Fan590 just reported 2 deals:
1) Richard Jefferson to MIL for Yi and Bobby Simmons
2) Seattle trades the #4 to LAC for #7 and a future #1
June 26th, 2008 at 3:24 pm
i would make that deal for maggette. if it’s available, bc would have to be stupid no to make it happen.
as far as jefferson goes…why wasn’t there an offer for bargnani and pieces for him? that is a bad trade by jersey…jefferson ha MUCH more value then that.
June 26th, 2008 at 4:58 pm
Well I’m happy, disappointed and concerned.
Happy - Jermaine is a good player. He can play defense and will shore up the interior
Disappointed - Two biggest Raptors needs were a (1) a perimeter who can score and create off the dribble (2) Perimeter defense
Concerned - I’m struggling to see how they cure the two problems Colangelo overlooked.
Will the Raptors have the worst group of perimeter players of any playoff team next season? Yes I think so.
Will it cost the Raptors any chances of being a serious postseason team? Yes I think so.
This trade will be defined by the next move. By Colangelo’s ability to get the team help on the perimeter and frankly he doesn’t have a huge number of assets to play with ….. but he does have one good new asset and that’s Andrea Bargnani. He’s expendable with Jermaine on board and could net some talent on the wing.
Free Agency likely won’t bring much of an upgrade on the wings. We’ll see how it plays out.
Daves last blog post..Introducing the 2008 NBA Draft
June 26th, 2008 at 5:08 pm
Looking down at Free Agency
- Maggette. Likely won’t sign for the MLE. Needs to be a sign and trade. Clippers desperate for backcourt help which the Raptors don’t have and that the Clippers can get elsewhere. Bargnani? Very low likelihood of Maggette in Toronto.
- JR Smith. Restricted free agent and the Nuggets are likely to match any MLE type offer.
- Tony Allen. Very risky and could be a complete non-event. His skill set is the opposite of the present Raptors though and needed. He’s an excellent penetrator, very athletic, and a good defensive player. Big injury concerns and hasn’t established himself as a consistent productive player. Interesting talent though.
- Ricky Davis. Long shot at being a good addition, a player with a history of mental difficulties on the basketball court. Talented.
So well they aren’t good options. Other than that the options are mainly lateral moves like Mo Evans. Most likely the upgrade will have to come through additional trades …. all eyes on Colangelo.
Unrelated note: Hollywood Gino, James Jones just became a free agent. That was surprising. I think it was a bad decision by Jones. I doubt he makes more than the 3mil he had guaranteed.
Daves last blog post..Trade Review: JO To Toronto
June 26th, 2008 at 6:16 pm
BTW everyone, join us for a live blog of the draft on http://raptorsnation.org
Arsenalists last blog post..Live Blogging the 2008 NBA Draft through Cover It Live
June 26th, 2008 at 6:35 pm
Why are people so enamored with the 17th pick. Joey graham is 17th pick. The draft is actually not that good. We have seen this film before, odds of getting a good player @ 17 much lower that J0 putting up 20-10 next season. Even trade if you ask me.
June 26th, 2008 at 11:49 pm
Dave,
I saw that earlier about James Jones and frankly I am also surprised. You got your wish…sned BC a letter and hope he listens. Im sure he will sign for at least 3 mil now that he is a “sharp shooter” (as espn described him). Shooters always go for more than they are worth,eh?
draft wise, with the 41st pick the Pacers (raps) pick another big man in Nathan jawai from Australia (6′10″, 270), making this team very big in a matter of one day. I think this pick has opened the door for the big trade for BC, but I dont think it is Bargnani going.
June 27th, 2008 at 12:05 am
what other pieces besides bargnani does bc have to shuffle around? He does have the mid-level but he needs that to fill out the roster.
June 27th, 2008 at 10:43 am
sounds like 2 teams exchanged cancers. one day this team may get the center they so desperately need. but it didn’t happen with this trade. i see history just repeating itself. alonzo and hakeem. and now this. just glad to see calderon will finally get his chance to shine. that is the only good part about this trade from where i sit.
June 27th, 2008 at 11:02 am
fyi- I just cut and pasted this from espn.com:
Wallace Almost Traded
Gerald Wallace | Bobcats
Charlotte Bobcats managing partner Michael Jordan confirmed to the Observer on Thursday that they were talking to the Raptors about a swap of Gerald Wallace and point guard T.J. Ford. The talks apparently hit a snag when Toronto additionally asked for a draft pick. Instead, the Raptors are moving Ford to Indiana in a trade involving forward Jermaine O’Neal. — The Charlotte Observer
June 27th, 2008 at 11:21 am
I have to say, I really like the moves that Indiana made last night. Trading Bayless for Jaret Jack and Josh Mcroberts and then picking Brandon Rush with the 13th…
Very very nice moves, and then taking Roy Hibbert, the best possible choice at 17th in my opinion.
Larry Bird is an early favorite for executive of the year.
Janitor, to compare JO to Alonzo and Hakeem is a little far fetched in my opinion. Those guys are old, and JO is 29.
I think this was an excellent trade for the Raptors. They are SIGNIFICANTLY improved because of this deal.
I think the Gerald Wallace trade would have also been great, but the need to replace Bargnani in the front court was a more pressing matter in my opinion. They can wing it with Kapono for one more year if they have to, but Andrea at centre is a much bigger liability.
The Bobcats got their point guard now.
June 30th, 2008 at 11:01 pm
Personally I am shocked about some fans response to The Oneal/Ford trade.
The Raptors were 41-41 last year with glaring weaknesses:
1. Defense (not just perimeter Defense) Defense everywhere.
2. Rebounding
3. Starting center. Rasho was solid for 30 games however not the answer
4. point guard dilemma
5. Small forward who can score and defend.
6. Andrea (was pretty bad last year)
So now the way I see it this trade has either solved 5 out of these 6 or improved them and here is how:
Providing he is healthy which I know is a big if but not so much as TJ the main piece going the other way. So lets look at the above six and allow me to explain how this trade either solves or improves 5 of these:
1. Defense (not just perimeter Defense) Defense everywhere. Oneal is a premier defender a shot blocker and can almost shut down any center in the NBA not named Howard.
2. Rebounding. Oneal is clearly a huge upgrade rebounding over Rasho and Andrea at starting center.
3. Starting center. Rasho was solid for 30 games however not the answer. I love Rasho but he is not a 6 time all star period. Oneal is much better.
4. point guard dilemma. Calderon will flourish playing 38 minutes a game as he did when Ford was injured.
5. Small forward who can score and defend. This deal does not help here however you could argue we have 2 solid shot blockers when opponents get through our perimeter defense.
6. Andrea (was pretty bad last year)
He gets to come off the bench relax not guard opposing starting centers and should be a top 5 big man coming of the bench and will still see significant playing time of close to 24 minutes a game.
Now lets talk about the present lets break the raptors down by category.
Bigs- Oneal, Bosh, AB7, The Hump
clearly the strength of the team. None better in the east. Bosh is getting better and better. Oneal is the best center we ever had and is not old. People he is 29 or 30 all bigs get hurt that is life in the NBA. When your 7 foot or close to it and play sports you will have leg problems. Shaq, Ewing, Hakeem, Bosh, Andrea and even Howard when he gets older will continue to get hurt so stop feeding me this BS about Oneal being this huge gamble so is everyone Big on the planet. Getting back to the our bigs Andrea and Hump are still super young and are going to have good years and get better with time. Andrea can still be a star maybe not a superstar but a real good player and Hump will have a solid NBA carrer and continue to bring energy.
Point guards- Calderon numbers were off the charts last year and playing 38 minutes this year will continue to get better, as for a back up Delfino Ukic or any decent free agent will be fine Most people don’t even Know CP3’s or Kidds or D WIlliams backup not a huge priority the was I see it.
Wings- Solid at 2 with Parker and Kapono not many superstar 2’s in east so we can get by here. Only concern is the 3 if any of Moon/Carlos?Joey can have a breakout season we will win it all. Cmon Moon.